Envelope-to: andrew@sterlingcal.com
Delivery-date: Fri, 28 Feb 2025 11:02:08 -0600
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Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2025 17:01:55 +0000 (UTC)
From: Collin Stewart <predictablerevenue-newsletter@mail.beehiiv.com>
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Message-ID: <ekUWZ5aPQq604ZKKmP2uJA@geopod-ismtpd-23>
Subject: prospecting for interviews
Reply-To: Collin Stewart <collin@predictablerevenue.com>
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To: "andrew@sterlingcal.com" <andrew@sterlingcal.com>

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Good morning Andrew,=20

_Reminder to all that signed up for my Advanced Reader Copy (ARC) program, =
I=E2=80=99d like to include some of your reviews / comments in the actual b=
ook. If you want the chance of being in there, I need your replies in by Ma=
rch 5th. If they come in after, they=E2=80=99re still helpful but they=E2=
=80=99ll be on the website or _[_Amazon page_](https://www.amazon.com/Terri=
fying-Art-Finding-Customers-Sleep-Deprived/dp/1774586134)_._

I=E2=80=99ve had a few of the same conversations this week and that=E2=80=
=99s usually a good sign it=E2=80=99s top of mind for many of you so today =
we=E2=80=99re talking prospecting for customer development interviews.=C2=
=A0

**tl;dr - if you=E2=80=99re under $1m in revenue, you probably should be re=
aching out and asking for advice instead of running traditional sales outre=
ach.=C2=A0**

One of the biggest struggles I see founders wrestle with is moving to sales=
 mode. Especially when it comes to finding people to sell to. I=E2=80=99ve =
written [about this](https://predictablerevenue-newsletter.beehiiv.com/p/le=
arn-and-land-customers) before when it comes to selling to folks that parti=
cipated in customer development interviews. But what about when that well r=
uns dry? Many founders get stressed because they don=E2=80=99t know what to=
 do next. But the obvious channel is staring right at you, more customer de=
velopment interviews.

I get a lot of resistance to this idea because founder feel like they=E2=80=
=99re going backwards. I get it, doing more customer development interviews=
 _feels _slow to start. But, as I=E2=80=99ll show you with real life math, =
it=E2=80=99s a more efficient method for reaching prospects AND has the add=
ed benefit of helping you learn along the way.=C2=A0

When you jump into prospecting as soon as the product is =E2=80=9Cready to =
sell,=E2=80=9D you likely won=E2=80=99t know enough to really dial in a sal=
es development campaign. This is, in part, because your product and who it =
serves are still likely to shift a little. If you move forward with prospec=
ting, you=E2=80=99ll likely have a bunch of unvalidated assumptions baked i=
nto your approach=E2=80=94who you=E2=80=99re reaching out to, what specific=
 pain they have, how your solution fits, even what channel they=E2=80=99re =
most active on. All it takes is one wrong assumption, and the whole thing c=
ollapses. It=E2=80=99s like a chain link system: if any single link breaks,=
 the entire chain is compromised.=C2=A0

In contrast, when you=E2=80=99re asking for advice, you open the conversati=
on in a much more collaborative way. People are happy to help someone who=
=E2=80=99s curious and eager to learn=E2=80=94it=E2=80=99s more appealing t=
han being sold to. It doesn=E2=80=99t matter if your targeting is off becau=
se in the worst case scenario, you get the opportunity to learn from someon=
e outside of what you thought your core profile was. And don=E2=80=99t worr=
y: you can always sell to them later, once you know they really do have the=
 problem you can solve and want to fix it.=C2=A0

Here=E2=80=99s how to think about it: instead of firing off cold sales emai=
ls, we use these same tactics to book customer development interviews. When=
 you switch from =E2=80=9CCan I sell you something?=E2=80=9D to =E2=80=9CCa=
n I learn from you?=E2=80=9D your reply rate can easily 5x. (Mine jumped fr=
om below 1% to 5% on my latest campaign.)

Why the jump? Because you=E2=80=99re not leading with a sales pitch=E2=80=
=94you=E2=80=99re leading with genuine curiosity and a willingness to adapt=
. This tactic only makes sense if you=E2=80=99re still open to changing you=
r product or approach based on what you learn. Once you have a mature roadm=
ap, a full product, and more than $1M in revenue, it=E2=80=99s harder to pl=
ay the =E2=80=9Csmall startup=E2=80=9D card. You can=E2=80=94and should=E2=
=80=94still ask for feedback, but this particular tactic won=E2=80=99t feel=
 as authentic.

Let=E2=80=99s look at a typical outbound sales process:

* Cold sales email nets about a 1% reply rate and 30% convert to a meeting.=
 So if you send 1k emails, you=E2=80=99ll book 3 meetings per week.

* Assume that 30% of those meetings become opportunities and you=E2=80=99ll=
 close 20% of them (which might be generous for outbound).=C2=A0

* That means you need about 5 weeks of prospecting just to land 5 real oppo=
rtunities and (hopefully) 1 sale.=C2=A0

* Then add a 2-week sales cycle, and you=E2=80=99re looking at 7 weeks to g=
et that first win. And that=E2=80=99s only if you already have the machine =
running smoothly=E2=80=94getting it all set up can take 2=E2=80=933 more mo=
nths.

* In the process, you blasted 5,000 total contacts=E2=80=94so your sales ef=
ficiency is 1/5,000 (0.0002).

Now let=E2=80=99s look at a customer development approach:

* Let=E2=80=99s assume a customer development email nets around a 5% reply =
rate with 80% converting to a meeting. These are the stats from a customer =
development campaign I=E2=80=99m running for myself.=C2=A0

* That means 1k contacts should result in 40 interviews.=C2=A0

* Let=E2=80=99s say you spread those 40 interviews out over a month (about =
10 per week). If you=E2=80=99ve identified a real, painful problem, 10% of =
those interviews should convert into paying customers.=C2=A0

* That means in about 10 weeks, you get 40 interviews and 4 future customer=
s.

* Even though this adds 5 more weeks to your overall cycle, you=E2=80=99ve =
contacted 1k people, learned from 40 different prospects, and closed 4 deal=
s. That=E2=80=99s a sales efficiency of 4/1,000 (0.004).

The customer development approach (0.004) is **20x** more efficient than th=
e standard sales dev approach (0.0002). And you end up with invaluable insi=
ghts that shape your product and messaging going forward. That=E2=80=99s go=
ing slow to go fast.

As for channels, I=E2=80=99ve tested this over LinkedIn and email. Both wor=
k as long as your target audience is active on the platform, and most peopl=
e are active on email.=C2=A0

On LinkedIn, you can add 30 people a day, wait for them to accept, and then=
 message them. Usually 20=E2=80=9330% accept (depending on industry), so th=
at=E2=80=99s 9 new connections a day. If your targeting is good, 5=E2=80=93=
10% of those people might book a meeting=E2=80=94or 1% if your audience doe=
sn=E2=80=99t use LinkedIn or you=E2=80=99re off the mark. Booking 5 meeting=
s a week is excellent, 2=E2=80=933 is okay, and 1 every two weeks probably =
means you need to recheck your approach.

Finally, let me just say: cold outbound isn=E2=80=99t evil. You can definit=
ely beat the standard metrics if you do it well. Just remember, targeting i=
s the most important element of any campaign. If you=E2=80=99re contacting =
a wide, generic audience, expect average (or worse) results. If you=E2=80=
=99re laser-focused on a tight group that cares deeply about a specific pro=
blem, you=E2=80=99ll see much better outcomes.

On the AI SDR front, I have mixed feelings. My biggest complaint is that AI=
 tools often abstract away the most crucial step=E2=80=94building high-qual=
ity lists and creative campaigns. The plus side is you can personalize at s=
cale, which can help deliverability if you do it correctly. But if you rely=
 on AI messaging to paper over a mediocre list, it=E2=80=99s not going to h=
elp you much. List quality trumps fancy messaging every time. That=E2=80=99=
s why I=E2=80=99m intrigued by [Apollo.io](https://Apollo.io)=E2=80=99s new=
 AI Messaging feature. It could be a game-changer if it truly lets you comb=
ine great targeting with AI-driven messaging. It=E2=80=99s early, so we=E2=
=80=99ll see. But I really like the idea of having more control over my cam=
paigns and still getting the benefit of AI messaging.=C2=A0

Bottom line: if you=E2=80=99re under $1M ARR, back off the hard sell and fo=
cus on customer development. Yes, it might be a little slower in the beginn=
ing, but you=E2=80=99ll build a better foundation, learn more, and set your=
self up for faster growth in the long run. Once you cross that $1M mark, yo=
u can still ask for feedback, but it becomes trickier to maintain that =E2=
=80=9CWe=E2=80=99re just a small startup=E2=80=9D vibe. So use this tactic =
while you still can=E2=80=94and watch how much faster you learn, adapt, and=
 ultimately close deals.

Happy prospecting.

Collin=C2=A0

PS - yes, I promised to send some invites for the community this week. No, =
I didn=E2=80=99t have time to do it. I was onboarding two new clients and t=
hat took up a bunch of the time I had planned. Keep your eyes out next week=
=E2=80=A6 hopefully.=20

PPS - the [pre-order page](https://www.amazon.com/Terrifying-Art-Finding-Cu=
stomers-Sleep-Deprived/dp/1774586134) is officially up on Amazon and I=E2=
=80=99m pumped. I=E2=80=99ll definitely have some bonuses for those who pre=
-order, if you have any ideas, hit me back here.=20


=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94

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</style></head><body class=3D"a" style=3D"margin:0px auto;padding:0px;word-=
wrap:normal;word-spacing:normal;background-color:#FFFFFF;"><div role=3D"art=
icle" aria-roledescription=3D"email" aria-label=3D"email_name" lang=3D"en" =
style=3D"font-size:1rem"><table role=3D"none" width=3D"100%" border=3D"0" c=
ellspacing=3D"0" align=3D"center" cellpadding=3D"0" class=3D"gg"><tr><td al=
ign=3D"center" valign=3D"top"><table role=3D"none" width=3D"670" border=3D"=
0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" class=3D"aa" style=3D"width:670px;ta=
ble-layout:fixed;"><tr><td class=3D"bodyWrapper" align=3D"center" valign=3D=
"top" style=3D"padding:10px 5px 10px 5px;"><table role=3D"none" width=3D"10=
0%" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"center"><tr><=
td align=3D"center" valign=3D"top" style=3D"border:0px solid #FFFFFF;border=
-radius:10px;background-color:#FFFFFF;" class=3D"c"><table role=3D"none" wi=
dth=3D"100%" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"cent=
er"><tr><td class=3D"f" align=3D"right" valign=3D"top" style=3D"padding:20p=
x 15px;"><p> February 28, 2025 &nbsp; | &nbsp; <a href=3D"https://link.mail=
.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u001.xDrLMY0giiSlGuELGCgU3vcTjpRMaSWzujUngxObjZYrCabQfdS8=
QeuInKYXW1f7m-kG_SH9feIMUKhj5-AH2uQrZtEQI6TtaiMC4cm2aKFMLaKJm-apFJhxiuBlhZx=
z1eIJPPhvNwi65GnA0TDxyrlT2lXkL0fhMfK3jjfrl7vqYP4ej5on-VdajRCVD2MuKddbs_pzXt=
Gw76_hYi22J4vvBfX2MMwPUNYXOfLdjgMBsDa1hrwXNhh0EPwOvHGMa-Y_ZZzby42tyntSt6gNd=
bTLQpfLlwLIQ_4r-KRvEEG_-lcwr5z4-_4MEZZm0N1owA4CABmdEmVere4DqqlfVe2gbzNPCSRv=
P89TqRssrqi68jML9WI_K8-nYEP0sr-u1svsgk9yD8notxQRunFKRKZ6XJoCUvAuj3TFe9oHodf=
pDEI-cUi_usx1rXMoBBT0LMj5pAuGLr_OrUmFuDh58YBMUe2ByL0SdFh68DX4X2W_5X3ei--xyU=
tIJ-_udcDYsIgBGViiJVMqUSpgJd_DmuOEVWkVyJBg8ScjFZonb9_Csvuk1JprREf6Mxf0NExGe=
khMpo7rLwrEQM-2j0jOVryT6s9DoeOvNfVAg3rkYoP-RW3pQDIvquqI7kerNnSZ32gT8hDNipga=
O6UBuMDTmMwt0IpeGwMzuGUMFRZAAN0gBDYZcLeX_sMTBcp5iK4qQUDkNpiPMmU2B49-ZLvwhr6=
cXC2LeIsA58Cx6FjxAgIJI-fEL7ssOxuZww8aO0q5amgZIf-SOkzH3PhlMN4_KmEuPEekyfFIfT=
xOdwy1ugF5Tm93qqrq7yY__6JSydVDSYf_KBCl17i4ZQYCxVGLoKe5cIsqL_-oSKoovGsHXuA/4=
ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/h0/h001.60CyWFTqFK3mYSexUtnyaa7Gox5hE5KQl8sLouQTM=
kw">Read Online</a></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"center" vali=
gn=3D"top" style=3D"padding:15px 15px 20px;"><table role=3D"none" width=3D"=
100%" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"center"><tr=
><td align=3D"center" valign=3D"top"><h1 style=3D"text-align:left;font-fami=
ly:'Trebuchet MS','Lucida Grande',Tahoma,sans-serif;font-weight:Bold;font-s=
ize:32px;color:#2A2A2A;padding:2px 0;line-height:38px;"> prospecting for in=
terviews </h1></td></tr></table></td></tr><tr><td align=3D"center" valign=
=3D"top" style=3D"padding:15px 15px 15px 15px;" class=3D"dd"><table role=3D=
"none" width=3D"100%" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" alig=
n=3D"center"><tr><td align=3D"left" valign=3D"middle" class=3D"mob-stack"><=
table role=3D"none" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=
=3D"right" class=3D"social-mobile"><tr><td align=3D"left" valign=3D"middle"=
><table role=3D"none" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" alig=
n=3D"left" style=3D"width:100%"><tr><td align=3D"center" valign=3D"middle">=
<a href=3D"https://link.mail.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u001.UY7-jEMcRLZ5W6M0bzLpmxH7=
-WTt-1gChtTcndEMyBoSwgSdDaOALV1MAeTHOBSUWCqEjdMxJtRDlZvsKnAu88Z1YRIslV1dQgA=
oGeH-LlK989xEpf95Db8ika45SlwhTcebUM9PZMOxcEU8EIFTSA1D4IK8_4Ns_aXrY42DRG9y75=
aCx3grdeZ36yGlHEWUFjQxBe_Ursbz0edcf5kyopaw9PZyZf-ezCOKoklyr60zLtCr6XuGm1NFE=
4gpevgMdflv1JjXjF7xUwf1EpUfp2JS7K_EDtlajUXl4PLsJ7tIczoPtzx5nxfBzy17rpT2sjyk=
MfnHSiYE9hyoCy1pA66UaFzqp9mnWAfehene4685BTDIndlpqVLCd7JDHCtwywz3lrAY986MH2j=
Gdf7NMw/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/h1/h001.0TRwPT_9Ku_bSbTSFovKlmDj6B1YKDql=
OMD5owNxgwE" style=3D"text-decoration:none; display:block;"><table role=3D"=
none" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"center"><tr=
><td align=3D"center" valign=3D"middle" style=3D"border: 1px solid #E5E7EB;=
 border-radius: 100%; width: 18px; height: 18px; padding: 8px;"><img style=
=3D"display:block; width:100%; height:100%; max-width:18px; max-height:18px=
; object-fit: contain;" alt=3D"share on facebook" width=3D"18" border=3D"0"=
 src=3D"https://media.beehiiv.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=3Dscale-down,format=3Da=
uto,onerror=3Dredirect,quality=3D80/static_assets/header/facebook.png"/></t=
d></tr></table></a></td><td width=3D"8" style=3D"width:8px;">&nbsp;</td><td=
 align=3D"center" valign=3D"middle"><a href=3D"https://link.mail.beehiiv.co=
m/ss/c/u001.eT_HH9j2kUx6jXW0PHemwzOjQOpuqUKCn7LAbiCzlo1oxUN44u16xvalV9lCzdH=
NBiGxJ35W2JgtX9Xo4q8B-GD__4k5qsGMhwfulOnHCFJkG6AKUBTPgALaaXaYvjxs0B6FXCS5ox=
OlyBbMCXMfC7IIIKZoReohbl_YMd5gnwKiExEtLUvB65dbWIB0GG2M7ovtFL4r_1Jb7zqMZQzxY=
2ecLYByYZHLF1MChEaW2KZX4dQdxv_iL_SkFUyuAgwigJqFYpeeGaOxDq25liC_nFcP5WRgCyTk=
lfL23fQVlgQ912rrTLb1qqH6xJxruWN4BvrH_VqqFLg8OPQ1A4ml92ReHTYFg1pLSkPqw6LppVq=
fgRB_XaDZ76cnhTAu8LN5XlbYqyPclXIn_AQD8JKcGg/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/h2/h=
001.1kuoIuqnLiC69hYQs8i-AV6TOqBxWdxz10JuDgAH_iA" style=3D"text-decoration:n=
one; display:block;"><table role=3D"none" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" ce=
llpadding=3D"0" align=3D"center"><tr><td align=3D"center" valign=3D"middle"=
 style=3D"border: 1px solid #E5E7EB; border-radius: 100%; width: 18px; heig=
ht: 18px; padding: 8px;"><img style=3D"display:block; width:100%; height:10=
0%; max-width:18px; max-height:18px; object-fit: contain;" alt=3D"share on =
twitter" width=3D"18" height=3D"18" border=3D"0" src=3D"https://media.beehi=
iv.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=3Dscale-down,format=3Dauto,onerror=3Dredirect,qual=
ity=3D80/static_assets/header/x.png"/></td></tr></table></a></td><td width=
=3D"8" style=3D"width:8px;">&nbsp;</td><td align=3D"center" valign=3D"middl=
e"><a href=3D"https://link.mail.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u001.UY7-jEMcRLZ5W6M0bzLpm=
9U9S1JYcj8zH88ooT01vXOKGqw1BJYJi8XJOykB3s2Lb7jZxgrJBXG9C9ZUz4moAa4Q_S2S42bt=
ZQnbWh52QxNmc9Sey79D_WV45TMqfsdRNLlhT8XLjKGG41BDjTfOihp75K39tMKlwun8mN2a7bO=
sxCxsKitqWSBvtYtB8Eso4lgNhnxRrcSJq_tad0T-mPxICPN1F5K4xLq7UN2fgf32Z_BDqkNKb0=
gybD3HXEWuI-I9ZRuFC0bmKhJK79kBr4mGce6RmbS4pfDYuHo5qgM-89cZgNrZsUqGKV8v3--eP=
PMiLut-PL8SePUtJ9r3IFjl7HC9hLmAoh5Fb4U3N1i4-8lHzOpfx9Rvv-269dwJgN1tcy80Sgjl=
AaNzNYXrBQ/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/h3/h001.iG8X7viN-UMxgGm1Q2ilbnf5nsVNW=
yTGIQC9Z-jSlv0" style=3D"text-decoration:none; display:block;"><table role=
=3D"none" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"center"=
><tr><td align=3D"center" valign=3D"middle" style=3D"border: 1px solid #E5E=
7EB; border-radius: 100%; width: 18px; height: 18px; padding: 8px;"><img st=
yle=3D"display:block; width:100%; height:100%; max-width:18px; max-height:1=
8px; object-fit: contain;" alt=3D"share on threads" width=3D"18" height=3D"=
18" border=3D"0" src=3D"https://media.beehiiv.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=3Dscale=
-down,format=3Dauto,onerror=3Dredirect,quality=3D80/static_assets/header/th=
reads.png"/></td></tr></table></a></td><td width=3D"8" style=3D"width:8px;"=
>&nbsp;</td><td align=3D"center" valign=3D"middle"><a href=3D"https://link.=
mail.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u001.UY7-jEMcRLZ5W6M0bzLpm5Vsol3-4mO68bGpSvtYIyCFMPHZ=
M3NHfCQCEvGpU3U82219i03ZXpcWbsDp4yL-p1i7f6hDWNjIp0cw1236CySaO_b2JfvcqfWpJja=
TinZwPqT1_vci0e7jxBohfGHEynv-DCzLUy5iPNPdmL3le9LYsYYJ24puQ1M2Yq4wmXWKhBqr0z=
xEdSRl5a-jnE55CKV9nVoknKHU0v1mm4PeLgC3yrIFizeuN5rOt7Luk_4wSlNpTBCPDXVe_neEm=
yKh6aDww5npUKmuXQEdaFthYu1KfMi3kgevNFK9tAmKfmvYMAPVOBG7GyK8BUD-atkvNk9rk9WI=
_JxJNflOC_4P7ZBsWH7ov3XEndaoV_0ED-w5rcQ-fu6Vw2Q-WxLXVlq-Y9pTMmVxpQkH_1BsCtS=
BXjY/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/h4/h001.deiw-TDSLCxZcbaZzY7HymeqeOBYJetc1Hs=
HjCuypww" style=3D"text-decoration:none; display:block;"><table role=3D"non=
e" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"center"><tr><t=
d align=3D"center" valign=3D"middle" style=3D"border: 1px solid #E5E7EB; bo=
rder-radius: 100%; width: 18px; height: 18px; padding: 8px;"><img style=3D"=
display:block; width:100%; height:100%; max-width:18px; max-height:18px; ob=
ject-fit: contain;" alt=3D"share on linkedin" width=3D"18" height=3D"18" bo=
rder=3D"0" src=3D"https://media.beehiiv.com/cdn-cgi/image/fit=3Dscale-down,=
format=3Dauto,onerror=3Dredirect,quality=3D80/static_assets/header/linkedin=
.png"/></td></tr></table></a></td></tr></table></td></tr></table></td></tr>=
</table></td></tr><tr><td style=3D"height:0px;width:0px;"><div style=3D"hei=
ght:1px;" data-open-tracking=3D"true"> <img src=3D"https://link.mail.beehii=
v.com/ss/o/u001.QDl44NxZBc1mRkS74rGpGQ/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/ho.gif" a=
lt=3D"" width=3D"1" height=3D"1" border=3D"0" style=3D"height:1px !importan=
t;width:1px !important;border-width:0 !important;margin-top:0 !important;ma=
rgin-bottom:0 !important;margin-right:0 !important;margin-left:0 !important=
;padding-top:0 !important;padding-bottom:0 !important;padding-right:0 !impo=
rtant;padding-left:0 !important;"/> </div></td></tr><tr id=3D"content-block=
s"><td class=3D"email-card-body" align=3D"center" valign=3D"top" style=3D"p=
adding-bottom:15px;"><table role=3D"none" width=3D"100%" border=3D"0" cells=
pacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"center"><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=
=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"=
><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Good=
 morning Andrew, </span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" s=
tyle=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=
=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"><i>Reminder t=
o all that signed up for my Advanced Reader Copy (ARC) program, I=E2=80=99d=
 like to include some of your reviews / comments in the actual book. If you=
 want the chance of being in there, I need your replies in by March 5th. If=
 they come in after, they=E2=80=99re still helpful but they=E2=80=99ll be o=
n the website or </i></span><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"><a class=
=3D"link" href=3D"https://link.mail.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u001.UY7-jEMcRLZ5W6M0b=
zLpmzKZu4CMZ-4VPqYNLlg6yrGxR2XQhddm9dZyX6mpnTOell2BYjET-Y8l9HDSfj1AJQh-u__O=
zm5nzjGP54xQkGt8BkBwNf31D79F3CPl6rqEOYvML0sHNXjdRLh7idTslKoKqAylmEs5dPklVRf=
Ih7rreKUQr8GJz3Jf2SBEa6DfW3_joiQNP5XI2CkoCVbZsDJJWUIsJURuFGLYGt6fg65nbnwqwK=
V9HIzfKPFJv0MDOpv7bAHvxNcKw3gM5JqLzHDMkdsRUTocG1WW8oigcFZ7yVZAlqrYXVqzElOp9=
8OPqqpupGaB5aZ_QPPQVj-GYQ/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/h5/h001.gwgQHebBvYNh-3=
DpiZlcNAPdGXI17Fp5qA_ahF2fUqU" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer=
 nofollow"><span><i>Amazon page</i></span></a></span><span style=3D"color:r=
gb(44, 62, 80);"><i>.</i></span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D=
"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p=
 style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">I=E2=80=
=99ve had a few of the same conversations this week and that=E2=80=99s usua=
lly a good sign it=E2=80=99s top of mind for many of you so today we=E2=80=
=99re talking prospecting for customer development interviews.=C2=A0</span>=
</p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px=
;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><sp=
an style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"><b>tl;dr - if you=E2=80=99re under $1m =
in revenue, you probably should be reaching out and asking for advice inste=
ad of running traditional sales outreach.=C2=A0</b></span></p></td></tr><tr=
><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;=
word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color=
:rgb(44, 62, 80);">One of the biggest struggles I see founders wrestle with=
 is moving to sales mode. Especially when it comes to finding people to sel=
l to. I=E2=80=99ve written </span><a class=3D"link" href=3D"https://link.ma=
il.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u001.xDrLMY0giiSlGuELGCgU3vcTjpRMaSWzujUngxObjZYrCabQfd=
S8QeuInKYXW1f7DL57eOYmrkEmWGxQKMNQEg2w6MVP6ygqz7iCbEHvqu3MBFyTlOZUi1WQJsHeY=
ZT_D3tLMiAP_GLex_9JkoKsVpJHMksMWt61H6mkyrcqvshLwvzsNd7lDIqWu1JCnigdfuqDm9d5=
UpIxt8Y7V6z446YyqXHszlQ3R3-QgQT2EGUh0kjTWxihgi2ZBOER6MdVBGsTw9fot80GKJiH4gG=
W9k6Cx3yGLDueQazk1IZ711ytDObVZZ7JSwpkF9_0LoWOsH4nPLBmzBePqJraBhJIyB_YhlQnW-=
jkdMz5TOmJCAK3WqFpZgpohPA2OsO8iFOW8lVceIeHKGcRaaCUPUBc6EO-2A5-jazp3665uc0MZ=
TJXXDGPwSEHC7Y-k3VdSk_do28Vwur09eeOFadgO-3HPKuz-5gyv7mOZdDyyngY_4IQJcqvVGdf=
1HVsUDDsOtzHDJN17zFxFKlno371YMT27bRir0WFExN8XgWMAqJjgtffy8Of5835rRaoC4GabxK=
LMPZsZUC1Osn9BufzMqDjq7rdTJlF83ByLve_XSTHVsWm_J5bCabd8qC8OZ437AdBXo4jWyPNcK=
UFeoOITJlIo-w3HbpAJfHdH6BIZTpw72uAZuV6tJLrZBxauRMAEbea5cTQF2daT6XLx1dPoO7NV=
O-1GkokJjlNII4z4VQj72FHeNhWJ5PyDOFpGDM8araSSdLTi3WreVSdOunpeh4P3IQkTY1aUAEt=
lTChFiP9zylDqovjrqfEtOcU1I4g8cPpAG1D3m9p-i5FCNkfqHmIHQ/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJ=
mctWNw/h6/h001.TVjVkjFU6z_1IvSAKLUDh2TXnxVQfsJvG80dlpWD0M4" target=3D"_blan=
k" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer nofollow"><span>about this</span></a><span st=
yle=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"> before when it comes to selling to folks th=
at participated in customer development interviews. But what about when tha=
t well runs dry? Many founders get stressed because they don=E2=80=99t know=
 what to do next. But the obvious channel is staring right at you, more cus=
tomer development interviews.</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" alig=
n=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;=
"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">I g=
et a lot of resistance to this idea because founder feel like they=E2=80=99=
re going backwards. I get it, doing more customer development interviews </=
span><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"><i>feels </i></span><span style=
=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">slow to start. But, as I=E2=80=99ll show you wi=
th real life math, it=E2=80=99s a more efficient method for reaching prospe=
cts AND has the added benefit of helping you learn along the way.=C2=A0</sp=
an></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 1=
5px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;">=
<span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">When you jump into prospecting as so=
on as the product is =E2=80=9Cready to sell,=E2=80=9D you likely won=E2=80=
=99t know enough to really dial in a sales development campaign. This is, i=
n part, because your product and who it serves are still likely to shift a =
little. If you move forward with prospecting, you=E2=80=99ll likely have a =
bunch of unvalidated assumptions baked into your approach=E2=80=94who you=
=E2=80=99re reaching out to, what specific pain they have, how your solutio=
n fits, even what channel they=E2=80=99re most active on. All it takes is o=
ne wrong assumption, and the whole thing collapses. It=E2=80=99s like a cha=
in link system: if any single link breaks, the entire chain is compromised.=
=C2=A0</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"pad=
ding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-heig=
ht:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">In contrast, when you=E2=
=80=99re asking for advice, you open the conversation in a much more collab=
orative way. People are happy to help someone who=E2=80=99s curious and eag=
er to learn=E2=80=94it=E2=80=99s more appealing than being sold to. It does=
n=E2=80=99t matter if your targeting is off because in the worst case scena=
rio, you get the opportunity to learn from someone outside of what you thou=
ght your core profile was. And don=E2=80=99t worry: you can always sell to =
them later, once you know they really do have the problem you can solve and=
 want to fix it.=C2=A0</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"le=
ft" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p st=
yle=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Here=E2=80=
=99s how to think about it: instead of firing off cold sales emails, we use=
 these same tactics to book customer development interviews. When you switc=
h from =E2=80=9CCan I sell you something?=E2=80=9D to =E2=80=9CCan I learn =
from you?=E2=80=9D your reply rate can easily 5x. (Mine jumped from below 1=
% to 5% on my latest campaign.)</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" al=
ign=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-wor=
d;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">W=
hy the jump? Because you=E2=80=99re not leading with a sales pitch=E2=80=94=
you=E2=80=99re leading with genuine curiosity and a willingness to adapt. T=
his tactic only makes sense if you=E2=80=99re still open to changing your p=
roduct or approach based on what you learn. Once you have a mature roadmap,=
 a full product, and more than $1M in revenue, it=E2=80=99s harder to play =
the =E2=80=9Csmall startup=E2=80=9D card. You can=E2=80=94and should=E2=80=
=94still ask for feedback, but this particular tactic won=E2=80=99t feel as=
 authentic.</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=
=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"li=
ne-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Let=E2=80=99s look =
at a typical outbound sales process:</span></p></td></tr><tr><td style=3D"p=
adding-bottom:12px;padding-left:37px;padding-right:27px;padding-top:12px;" =
class=3D"ee"><div style=3D"margin-left:0px;" class=3D"edm_outlooklist"><ul =
style=3D"list-style-type:disc;margin:0px 0px;padding:0px 0px 0px 0px;"><li =
class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;padding:0px;text-ali=
gn:left;word-break:break-word;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Cold=
 sales email nets about a 1% reply rate and 30% convert to a meeting. So if=
 you send 1k emails, you=E2=80=99ll book 3 meetings per week.</span></p></l=
i><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;padding:0px;te=
xt-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);=
">Assume that 30% of those meetings become opportunities and you=E2=80=99ll=
 close 20% of them (which might be generous for outbound).=C2=A0</span></p>=
</li><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;padding:0px=
;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 8=
0);">That means you need about 5 weeks of prospecting just to land 5 real o=
pportunities and (hopefully) 1 sale.=C2=A0</span></p></li><li class=3D"list=
Item ultext"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;padding:0px;text-align:left;word-=
break:break-word;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Then add a 2-week=
 sales cycle, and you=E2=80=99re looking at 7 weeks to get that first win. =
And that=E2=80=99s only if you already have the machine running smoothly=E2=
=80=94getting it all set up can take 2=E2=80=933 more months.</span></p></l=
i><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;padding:0px;te=
xt-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);=
">In the process, you blasted 5,000 total contacts=E2=80=94so your sales ef=
ficiency is 1/5,000 (0.0002).</span></p></li></ul></div></td></tr><tr><td c=
lass=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-b=
reak:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(4=
4, 62, 80);">Now let=E2=80=99s look at a customer development approach:</sp=
an></p></td></tr><tr><td style=3D"padding-bottom:12px;padding-left:37px;pad=
ding-right:27px;padding-top:12px;" class=3D"ee"><div style=3D"margin-left:0=
px;" class=3D"edm_outlooklist"><ul style=3D"list-style-type:disc;margin:0px=
 0px;padding:0px 0px 0px 0px;"><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"li=
ne-height:24px;padding:0px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><span st=
yle=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Let=E2=80=99s assume a customer development =
email nets around a 5% reply rate with 80% converting to a meeting. These a=
re the stats from a customer development campaign I=E2=80=99m running for m=
yself.=C2=A0</span></p></li><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"line-=
height:24px;padding:0px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><span style=
=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">That means 1k contacts should result in 40 inte=
rviews.=C2=A0</span></p></li><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"line=
-height:24px;padding:0px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><span styl=
e=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Let=E2=80=99s say you spread those 40 intervie=
ws out over a month (about 10 per week). If you=E2=80=99ve identified a rea=
l, painful problem, 10% of those interviews should convert into paying cust=
omers.=C2=A0</span></p></li><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><p style=3D"line-=
height:24px;padding:0px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><span style=
=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">That means in about 10 weeks, you get 40 interv=
iews and 4 future customers.</span></p></li><li class=3D"listItem ultext"><=
p style=3D"line-height:24px;padding:0px;text-align:left;word-break:break-wo=
rd;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Even though this adds 5 more we=
eks to your overall cycle, you=E2=80=99ve contacted 1k people, learned from=
 40 different prospects, and closed 4 deals. That=E2=80=99s a sales efficie=
ncy of 4/1,000 (0.004).</span></p></li></ul></div></td></tr><tr><td class=
=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break=
:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 6=
2, 80);">The customer development approach (0.004) is </span><span style=3D=
"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"><b>20x</b></span><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, =
80);"> more efficient than the standard sales dev approach (0.0002). And yo=
u end up with invaluable insights that shape your product and messaging goi=
ng forward. That=E2=80=99s going slow to go fast.</span></p></td></tr><tr><=
td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;wo=
rd-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:r=
gb(44, 62, 80);">As for channels, I=E2=80=99ve tested this over LinkedIn an=
d email. Both work as long as your target audience is active on the platfor=
m, and most people are active on email.=C2=A0</span></p></td></tr><tr><td c=
lass=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-b=
reak:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(4=
4, 62, 80);">On LinkedIn, you can add 30 people a day, wait for them to acc=
ept, and then message them. Usually 20=E2=80=9330% accept (depending on ind=
ustry), so that=E2=80=99s 9 new connections a day. If your targeting is goo=
d, 5=E2=80=9310% of those people might book a meeting=E2=80=94or 1% if your=
 audience doesn=E2=80=99t use LinkedIn or you=E2=80=99re off the mark. Book=
ing 5 meetings a week is excellent, 2=E2=80=933 is okay, and 1 every two we=
eks probably means you need to recheck your approach.</span></p></td></tr><=
tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:lef=
t;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"col=
or:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Finally, let me just say: cold outbound isn=E2=80=99t =
evil. You can definitely beat the standard metrics if you do it well. Just =
remember, targeting is the most important element of any campaign. If you=
=E2=80=99re contacting a wide, generic audience, expect average (or worse) =
results. If you=E2=80=99re laser-focused on a tight group that cares deeply=
 about a specific problem, you=E2=80=99ll see much better outcomes.</span><=
/p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;=
text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><spa=
n style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">On the AI SDR front, I have mixed feelin=
gs. My biggest complaint is that AI tools often abstract away the most cruc=
ial step=E2=80=94building high-quality lists and creative campaigns. The pl=
us side is you can personalize at scale, which can help deliverability if y=
ou do it correctly. But if you rely on AI messaging to paper over a mediocr=
e list, it=E2=80=99s not going to help you much. List quality trumps fancy =
messaging every time. That=E2=80=99s why I=E2=80=99m intrigued by </span><s=
pan style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"><a class=3D"link" href=3D"https://link=
.mail.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u001.iXk3Za8dyNka01f9qmmpsSOrFKtHNtZc_czys4S6lRIe_Pd=
yCNHxf6Ebk8aVwAUJv2BB2RM_BuZ-f5crD8E_9uGt43TcFJVDVFoC8QdUrM2QSvZcuPvfI90KqM=
qxTE2QNs123zSZ9f_EuUaJ86KhUTeYmgXW9czBAX0-1rpS-oUzmqkdOLrruxFyNs4mYzOTF_10F=
Zk9zAyhRWOU3yDkqVakKiuslkkAz2hwkJD1kC5pe8CgSu-J0KyN-kRtUWN1/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmK=
p1NWJmctWNw/h7/h001.sJc58XYI_3PTHOhZ9TaRrvcibT22BeF76PV85WzRhBs" target=3D"=
_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer nofollow"><span>Apollo.io</span></a></sp=
an><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">=E2=80=99s new AI Messaging featu=
re. It could be a game-changer if it truly lets you combine great targeting=
 with AI-driven messaging. It=E2=80=99s early, so we=E2=80=99ll see. But I =
really like the idea of having more control over my campaigns and still get=
ting the benefit of AI messaging.=C2=A0</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=
=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break=
:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 6=
2, 80);">Bottom line: if you=E2=80=99re under $1M ARR, back off the hard se=
ll and focus on customer development. Yes, it might be a little slower in t=
he beginning, but you=E2=80=99ll build a better foundation, learn more, and=
 set yourself up for faster growth in the long run. Once you cross that $1M=
 mark, you can still ask for feedback, but it becomes trickier to maintain =
that =E2=80=9CWe=E2=80=99re just a small startup=E2=80=9D vibe. So use this=
 tactic while you still can=E2=80=94and watch how much faster you learn, ad=
apt, and ultimately close deals.</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" a=
lign=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-wo=
rd;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">=
Happy prospecting.</span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" =
style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=
=3D"line-height:24px;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">Collin=C2=A0<=
/span></p></td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0p=
x 15px;text-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px=
;"><span style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">PS - yes, I promised to send some=
 invites for the community this week. No, I didn=E2=80=99t have time to do =
it. I was onboarding two new clients and that took up a bunch of the time I=
 had planned. Keep your eyes out next week=E2=80=A6 hopefully. </span></p><=
/td></tr><tr><td class=3D"dd" align=3D"left" style=3D"padding:0px 15px;text=
-align:left;word-break:break-word;"><p style=3D"line-height:24px;"><span st=
yle=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);">PPS - the </span><span style=3D"color:rgb(44=
, 62, 80);"><a class=3D"link" href=3D"https://link.mail.beehiiv.com/ss/c/u0=
01.UY7-jEMcRLZ5W6M0bzLpmzKZu4CMZ-4VPqYNLlg6yrGxR2XQhddm9dZyX6mpnTOell2BYjET=
-Y8l9HDSfj1AJQh-u__Ozm5nzjGP54xQkGt8BkBwNf31D79F3CPl6rqEOYvML0sHNXjdRLh7idT=
slKoKqAylmEs5dPklVRfIh7rreKUQr8GJz3Jf2SBEa6DfW3_joiQNP5XI2CkoCVbZsDJJWUIsJU=
RuFGLYGt6fg65nbnwqwKV9HIzfKPFJv0MDOpv7bAHvxNcKw3gM5JqLzDf-6GEoDeeyRamgrZ4fU=
2ZVZKLFaz1jvD_1zxC0SLQL1XxxXKG0AgLlxmwtld3diw/4ee/AFnc2_7oSmKp1NWJmctWNw/h8=
/h001.YSsSnSZpK9t6X-tw9aEaTClLfE4QoFS4-2JKSyMDcS4" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D=
"noopener noreferrer nofollow"><span>pre-order page</span></a></span><span =
style=3D"color:rgb(44, 62, 80);"> is officially up on Amazon and I=E2=80=99=
m pumped. I=E2=80=99ll definitely have some bonuses for those who pre-order=
, if you have any ideas, hit me back here. </span></p></td></tr></table></t=
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